PTT偶像團體區 / KingofPop (麥可傑克森 - Michael Jackson)

Re: [情報] 關於MJ的學術研討會

看板KingofPop (麥可傑克森 - Michael Jackson)作者oldtrafford (oldtrafford)時間15年前 (2010/10/04 22:49)推噓2(2推 0噓 3→)

留言5則, 2人參與討論串4/4 (看更多)

我看了MJFC討論串有一篇也很有意思是在討論串第三頁講到J5進入Motown前的表演還有Motown對他們的改變 Here is the YouTube clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxgiKYzD7mQ

It's very old tape, so it is best if you download it in the highest quality and watch it from your hard drive. 這裡是youtube的影片雖然畫質頗遭但很有意思而且應該是MJ現存公開表演最早的影片 It was explained and emphasized quite strongly that the J5 did not perform for teeny-boppers. Their act, which was extremely honed and professional, was for ADULT audiences of educated concert-goers (not just strip-club alcoholics). You can see the audience in this clip. 研討會中以這個影片舉例 J5一開始的表演模式並不是青少年泡泡糖的歌曲他們的表演事實上非常的職業和老練而且針對的觀眾是成人的演唱會群眾不只侷限於脫衣舞吧影片中也有看到當時的觀眾 It was also explained how much J5 worked during the years before Motown, which was when MJ was between 7-11 years old. They did whole weeks of three to four performances a night (the last of which would be around 4 am) with all the greatest black groups at the time. We got to see some of the original posters advertising the shows. The J5 had a regular club circuit and were well-known in Chicago. 這影片也顯示了他們在Motown前是怎麼表演的當時MJ是7-11歲左右他們一個晚上會表演 3-4次最晚的表演完了會是凌晨四點而且和他們表演的都是當時最好的黑人藝人研討會也放出了當時的宣傳海報 J5當時有固定的酒吧演出行程而且在芝加哥已經很出名 Jake Austen, who lead the panel, is researching and writing a book on the history of soul music in Chicago (one of the most important cities for the development of black music in the US), which of course, includes the beginning of the J5 prior to Motown. 研討會這個主題的引領者Jake Austen 做了很多研究和寫了一本關於芝加哥靈魂音樂的歷史就有描寫到J5在進入Motown前的起源 So, we were treated to some of that history and the panel consisted of people who were there and helped to shape that history. So, Jake made it his business to make sure that we understood the J5 was fully developed as a performing group prior to Motown. And they were a SOUL group, which you will see in this video. He said they were great - Michael was electrifying on stage, and the band was tight (in other words, Jermaine and Tito really were playing and were darn good). (Just as one example of the type of music and style they were doing, he cited the moment MJ asks the audience to "soul clap" with them. Austen said Motown audiences wouldn't have even known what that meant, much less how to do it.) 研討會中展示了很多資料來重建當時的歷史 Jake表示大家必須了解在J5進入Motown之前事實上就已經是一個很成熟的表演團體而當時他們是靈魂樂的團體當時他們就已經很出色了麥可在台上就已經充滿電力而整個樂團也相當紮實 Jermaine和Tito等人是確實現場演出樂器此外他也表示影片中MJ要求觀眾跟著他拍手的表演方式也是一種典型靈魂樂團體演出的特色他說Motown的聽眾會完全不了解MJ的要求是什麼也會不知道要怎麼做 And because they were playing for adults, he said their professionalism was such that these kids had to come on stage and know how to work an audience and cater it to adult sensibilities. So, he showed this video to show a young MJ (ten years old? maybe just turned 11? I have to look that up) dancing, using his voice, and catering his whole performance in general to an adult audience. It made me realize how much Motown changed them as a group. 而且因為他們是在未成人表演他們的演出也必須去迎合成人的口味他表示影片中的小MJ 利用他的舞蹈和聲音而他的表演方式是針對成人觀眾的而我才知道Motowne對這個團體改變有多大 Of course, it was seeing some of the things you'll see in this video that made us all scream with laughter (when I said that above, I meant it was us laughing, not the audience in the video). So, besides the dancing, listen to MJ's vocal inflections and compare those to his Motown years. I found myself wishing that they'd never gone to Motown! And another strong thought I had when I watched it was how much it reminded me of MJ's movements in You Rock My World. I guess I realized that in some ways, the progression of his musical development over the decades was to come "home" to his original roots. 單然看到這些影片與會的聽眾都笑了(我說的是參加研討會的人而不是影片的聽眾) 除了舞蹈聽MJ聲音的表達方式在比較Motwon時期我發現我自己希望當初他們沒加入 Motown 而當我看這些影片時讓我想起了很多MJ後期在you rock my world的舞步我想 MJ的音樂發展在這數十年來回歸了他最原始的發源地 Clinton Ghent was on the panel - he choreographed this routine. And guess what he wears?! White socks and loafers. LOL! I guess that was MJ's first contact with his signature look. Clinton was telling us that he taught the J5 how to slow down their steps so they wouldn't come back to their mikes breathless from dancing so fast. He said they barely needed to be taught anything: "They had the rhythm. I just had to show them some little techniques." Clinton Ghent也在這個主題會上他當年編了這個舞而猜猜他穿了什麼白襪子和懶人皮鞋哈哈我想我發現了MJ的標誌性裝扮的源頭 Clinton告訴我們他怎麼敎J5舞步要慢一點免的他們要唱歌時因為跳太快而喘不過氣他也說他們基本上不需要被敎什麼他們本就很有韻律感我只要交他們一些訣竅 So, this is one of two (that Austen knew of) videos of the J5 prior to Motown. It was for the Miss Black America pageant in Madison Square Garden. I think he said it was from 1969, but that's what I have to look up. 這就是其中一個J5進入Motown前的影片這是在麥迪遜花園廣場舉辦的美國非裔小姐的慶祝會時間應該是1969年 (後來作者有找到這個影片是J5剛加入Motown不久的表演) He said he knows of another video that exists but he hasn't seen it yet. He said there is a person making a documentary and he thinks both of these will be included in it. 他說還有另一個影片存在他說有人正在做記錄片而他確定這兩個影片都會被放入 He also told us that the very first recording that the J5 ever made was discovered a couple of weeks ago. He heard about it and tracked it down. We saw a picture of it in the box they found it in. 他說J5第一次錄製的唱片在幾週前被發現了他聽說了之後去找他也展示了照片顯示他們是在哪個盒子裡找到的 So, he's doing a lot of really important research. He said if anyone was in Chicago in those days who could tell him anything about those first days of the J5 or even just about the club circuit and other performers there, he would love to hear from them and would be interviewing everyone. Reply With Quote 他說他做了很多的相關研究而芝加哥地區如果有任何人知道J5早期演出的酒吧巡演路線等資訊他會很希望能有所交流 -- ※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc) ◆ From: 130.85.56.85

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losesoul01

10/04 23:03, , 1^F

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losesoul01

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10/04 23:03, 2^F

多謝指證我看幾篇有去的人的討論他們說會中的確認為Motown為了吸引青少年而把 J5塑造成今天所謂泡泡糖男孩團體其實很多西洋音樂研究講到90年代紅翻boy band的原身 J5就是非常著名的例子和起源 ※ 編輯: oldtrafford 來自: 130.85.56.85 (10/04 23:09)